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Post by mortsahlfan on Feb 16, 2021 16:30:49 GMT -5
My cousin was over yesterday. I got him into The Doors when he was about 13, and now he's days away from turning 27, so of course we talked more about Jim. He asked lots of questions, since he hasn't read any books yet. Of course I gave him the link to this site, but he never signed up.
Anyway, I was telling him how ironic that I've been a fan of The Doors for the same length of time he's been alive.. I posed him questions, how everyone has their own secrets. Some people mislead, lie, distort or just don't share information.
People like to blame The Doors and fame, but I like to mention how Jim had been arrested as a teenager for public drunkenness and stealing a cop's hat and umbrella from his patrol car! Before joining The Doors, he was homeless living on a rooftop, eating only baked beans and LSD.
If you listen to early live recordings from 1966, you can still hear how shy he is. Months later when they made it big with "Light My Fire" there weren't 50 people to play for, but 5,000, and this happened in a VERY short amount of time. It's usually many reasons, some reasons Jim couldn't nail down. Combination of this and that, maybe being at the top, big star, having his poetry out in the public in songs, getting all the women, money, etc., but then still not satisfied, which would lead an intelligent person to wonder, "Damn, if THIS is the best" and he probably poured more alcohol on the pain, making the pain increase after not drinking, and to avoid withdrawals, he'd have to keep drinking just to function.
By nighttime, Alex Van Halen would wake up in the middle of the night and have hallucinations of penises, and chances are he drank right before falling asleep.
I think you can learn a lot more about a person by the kind of movies they watch (as opposed to music) and we know Jim was a huge movie-lover. His favorite movie was Anatahan and he had "The Battle of Algiers - 1966" scribbled on a page from a notebook. He seemed to like the New Wave from Europe. He's mentioned also liking documentaries and surrealism. He named Jack Palance and Sarah Miles as his favorite actor/actress when filling out his Elektra profile.
I would go to the source, Jim's video, audio, text (but realize we all put a "front" or act unnaturally when we know we're being recorded) and then go to those close to him (siblings, bandmates) and then once you have a good foundation, THEN read the books, since most of them aren't very informative. They mostly seem to consist of a formula of taking a quote of his, and then expanding, and then adding opinions, and throwing in events in chronological order.
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Post by leonora on Feb 25, 2021 5:47:12 GMT -5
Thank you for your thoughts. I always thought that Jim had bipolar disorder what emerged in his adoloscence. Bipolar disorder would explain his behavior, his alcohol problems, I mean, that alcohol was partly an escape and partly a kind of "cover" of his psychological problems.
I agree with you, the so-called biographies gives not a true portray about Jim. Most of them (in particular Hopkins, Davis, Wall) are interested only in gossips, scandals and pseudo-psychology (God, how many fake Wallmart-psychology!); and even the best biography, Riordan's book is full of distorted informations of frustrated ex-lovers, friends (or alleged lovers and friends). In effect, one of them does not analyze Jim's poetry and put it to context of literary history (except some superficial remark on influence of beat poets, Arthur Rimbaud etc.) And beyond his poems, lyrics and movies, his favourite books, movies, paintings, music etc. tells us the most important things about Jim. Of course, not only the few book and movie constantly repeated Nietzsche/Rimbaud/Elvis etc., but, as you wrote, The Anatahan, The Battle of Algiers… And Jim knew well chief work of Dante, Joyce, Stravinsky, Bartók, he was aware of Rudolf Nureyev's work - and I can to continue the list. |
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Post by mortsahlfan on Feb 25, 2021 11:04:31 GMT -5
Thank you for your thoughts. I always thought that Jim had bipolar disorder what emerged in his adoloscence. Bipolar disorder would explain his behavior, his alcohol problems, I mean, that alcohol was partly an escape and partly a kind of "cover" of his psychological problems.
I agree with you, the so-called biographies gives not a true portray about Jim. Most of them (in particular Hopkins, Davis, Wall) are interested only in gossips, scandals and pseudo-psychology (God, how many fake Wallmart-psychology!); and even the best biography, Riordan's book is full of distorted informations of frustrated ex-lovers, friends (or alleged lovers and friends). In effect, one of them does not analyze Jim's poetry and put it to context of literary history (except some superficial remark on influence of beat poets, Arthur Rimbaud etc.) And beyond his poems, lyrics and movies, his favourite books, movies, paintings, music etc. tells us the most important things about Jim. Of course, not only the few book and movie constantly repeated Nietzsche/Rimbaud/Elvis etc., but, as you wrote, The Anatahan, The Battle of Algiers… And Jim knew well chief work of Dante, Joyce, Stravinsky, Bartók, he was aware of Rudolf Nureyev's work - and I can to continue the list.
I wish you would continue with the list!
I think you can learn the most by checking out one's favorite movies (especially for a guy who loved film like Jim, even going to UCLA Film School) and other works. The only books I would ever recommend are:
-Friends Gathered Together -Summer With Morrison (despite not knowing if the quotations are very accurate, but I'll trust the author, who was a friend of Jim's) and the book by his band-mates, John and Ray.. Once you know the basics, I think reading the other stuff won't distort the truth so much, if you have a good foundation. Many times on these e-books, I'll simple do a search for certain keywords, like "favorite" or "loved" "hated", "movie" etc...
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Post by leonora on Feb 25, 2021 19:47:46 GMT -5
OK. 
I read Jim liked Eiseinstein's Battleship Patomkin and the Casablanca, Fellini's, Bergman's, von Stemberg's movie and according to Grace Moore the next movies: If, Ace in the Hole, A Lion is in the Street, A Face in the Crowd. He knew personally Fernando Arraball and Paul Bowles - I think he read and liked Arraball's poems and Bowles' roman. Arraball mentions him in his Baltazar-letters, and wrote a poem on Jim. Jim admired Kafka's Diary, too. Carmina Burana was one of his favourite music pieces, and he liked Bosch, El Greco, Turner, Dalí, Henri Rousseau paintings. I am trying to collect additional names and works.
I like, to, book of Dennis C. Jakob, and I agree with your opinion. His quotations sometimes are suspicious, he sometimes remembers inaccurately (e.g I read that Sándor Ferenczi was Jim's favourite psychologist, not Jung), but the guy is trustworthy and good intent, and gives us a lot of exciting informations.
And yes, Lisciandro's book is the best work on Jim!
I also like books's of the band-mates, but with critics. Of course, they are trying to explain own roles and faults, sometimes they "forget" things and at times it can be felt a particular mix of jealousy, frustration and remorse. But both are interesting and exciting readings.
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Post by mortsahlfan on Feb 27, 2021 8:46:49 GMT -5
OK.
I read Jim liked Eiseinstein's Battleship Patomkin and the Casablanca, Fellini's, Bergman's, von Stemberg's movie and according to Grace Moore the next movies: If, Ace in the Hole, A Lion is in the Street, A Face in the Crowd. He knew personally Fernando Arraball and Paul Bowles - I think he read and liked Arraball's poems and Bowles' roman. Arraball mentions him in his Baltazar-letters, and wrote a poem on Jim. Jim admired Kafka's Diary, too. Carmina Burana was one of his favourite music pieces, and he liked Bosch, El Greco, Turner, Dalí, Henri Rousseau paintings. I am trying to collect additional names and works.
I like, to, book of Dennis C. Jakob, and I agree with your opinion. His quotations sometimes are suspicious, he sometimes remembers inaccurately (e.g I read that Sándor Ferenczi was Jim's favourite psychologist, not Jung), but the guy is trustworthy and good intent, and gives us a lot of exciting informations.
And yes, Lisciandro's book is the best work on Jim!
I also like books's of the band-mates, but with critics. Of course, they are trying to explain own roles and faults, sometimes they "forget" things and at times it can be felt a particular mix of jealousy, frustration and remorse. But both are interesting and exciting readings.
Thank you so much!
I've read a good number of these names, but you seem to have a desire for the truth like I, so I'll prefer your answers over most of the books.
"Ace in the Hole" is one of my favorite movies, along with "A Face in the Crowd", which I never knew Jim admire.. Both are movies that symbolize America, but also that media/influence element.... I wish I read more than autobiographies. I'm almost 40 but have only read a single fictional book, and that was almost 20 years ago (Catcher in the Rye), but it's too bad Jim never talked about movies specifically in interviews, with at least desire.. He mentioned "Easy Rider" and its success, but I don't ever make assumptions.
I've read from those close to him (I think Babe Hill in "Friends Gathered Together") about his favorite movie being "Anatahan".. When I found this out, I saw it, and loved it, a 10/10.. Interesting how its narrated by his old teacher/director, despite it being a Japanese movie.. Speaking which, in the early-mid 60s when he wrote "Notes on Vision", he mentioned how the best movies were from the East.
I also wonder if he'd see a movie like "They Shoot Horses, Don't They?" (and many others), and was sad for him that he missed out on most of the 70s, a great decade for movies, and maybe the best, although I love the 60s, especially internationally (and the decades before)..
I've had this idea before, but yesterday again while I was walking, I thought how cool/accurate it would be to write a book with members from here, to have "checks" on each other, in case WE forget something, or took something from a bad source, etc..
"A Lion Is in the Streets" has James Cagney, and is loosely based on the life of Huey Long, one of a few politicians from the last 100 years I actually like. I hate paying for stuff, but if I can't find it online, I'll dish out the $4 from my cable. Thanks again!
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Post by leonora on Mar 1, 2021 19:14:43 GMT -5
Thank you very much for your kind words. Yes, I have a desire for the truth - instead myths or demystification - and I have found that you reject, too, both myths and counter-myths.
I admire your knowledge of cinema! I am not a great movie-specialist (I prefer rather literature, theater and music), so I grateful for your thoughts. Yes, unfortunately Jim mentioned only a few movies in his interviews. Informations on "Ace in the Hole" and "A Face in the Crowd" was taken by me from Kubernik's book (Kubernik, Harvey. 2018, The Doors Summer's Gone Otherworld. Cottage Industries: New York), from recollections of Grace Moore, and I thought that yes, these movies fit exactly to Jim'a thinking. Of his enthusiasm for Eisenstein's movie I read in Opsasnick-book was written on Jim's adolescense in Alexandia (Opsasnick, Mark. 2006. The Lizard King Was Here: The Life and Times of Jim Morrison in Alexandria, Virginia. XLibris). I recommend you both books. perhaps they are available in e-book format. I mean he had very exact and sharp views on the media's mechanism. I mean he had very exact and sharp views on the media's mechanism.
"Notes on Vision" is a treasury of Jim's views and knowledge on movie and psychology.
I am sure that we can do a more precise work in writing biography than some so-called biographers… My experience that a lot of people on different forums are more aware in source criticism and can analyse better informations than some of them.
BTW: I was planned to travel to Paris in this year again for the fiftieth anniversary of Jim (I was there in 2018 and 2019, an of I visited Pére Lachaise and I went to Rue de Beautreliis 17). But I am afraid that because of the pandemia it is remains just a dream...
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Post by mortsahlfan on Mar 2, 2021 8:58:22 GMT -5
Thank you very much for your kind words. Yes, I have a desire for the truth - instead myths or demystification - and I have found that you reject, too, both myths and counter-myths.
I admire your knowledge of cinema! I am not a great movie-specialist (I prefer rather literature, theater and music), so I grateful for your thoughts. Yes, unfortunately Jim mentioned only a few movies in his interviews. Informations on "Ace in the Hole" and "A Face in the Crowd" was taken by me from Kubernik's book (Kubernik, Harvey. 2018, The Doors Summer's Gone Otherworld. Cottage Industries: New York), from recollections of Grace Moore, and I thought that yes, these movies fit exactly to Jim'a thinking. Of his enthusiasm for Eisenstein's movie I read in Opsasnick-book was written on Jim's adolescense in Alexandia (Opsasnick, Mark. 2006. The Lizard King Was Here: The Life and Times of Jim Morrison in Alexandria, Virginia. XLibris). I recommend you both books. perhaps they are available in e-book format. I mean he had very exact and sharp views on the media's mechanism. I mean he had very exact and sharp views on the media's mechanism.
"Notes on Vision" is a treasury of Jim's views and knowledge on movie and psychology.
I am sure that we can do a more precise work in writing biography than some so-called biographers… My experience that a lot of people on different forums are more aware in source criticism and can analyse better informations than some of them.
BTW: I was planned to travel to Paris in this year again for the fiftieth anniversary of Jim (I was there in 2018 and 2019, an of I visited Pére Lachaise and I went to Rue de Beautreliis 17). But I am afraid that because of the pandemia it is remains just a dream...
I actually have "The Lizard King Was Here" after your recommendation. I've had it next to me on my couch for months. I liked the author's desire for truth, too. I read it while waiting for an eye exam, but have only opened up random pages since (something I do with many books), but just haven't had the energy. It's much easier for my eyes (and neck, back) to read it on my TV (I connect my laptop to it), and I keep telling myself I need the nutrition of a movie, but I've seen thousands, but I still find a few good ones a year... I think you also recommended me "Summer's Almost Gone", which I also have on the couch.
I can't live without music - it's the first thing I put on after I wake up. It's always on in the background.
What are your favorite bands/artists? I love Pink Floyd, The Doors, Supertramp, Led Zeppelin, The Who, Steely Dan, Stones, Beatles, Black Sabbath, Curved Air, Illusion, etc.. Here's my mp3 list as of last month (with some Delfonics, Yes, etc added recently)
I read biographies, but I have read less than 5 fiction books in my life, despite having some around, saving them for that period, if it ever comes.
I spent a lot of my 20s (and early 30s) traveling, been to Europe 5 times, and almost went to Paris because of an anniversary, hoping to meet other Doors' fans. My Dutch friend decided she wouldn't take off work, and so I stayed with her... I hope you go, and I hope this pandemic is over soon. I have remained at home, even ordering my groceries online. My travel days are over.
Music
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Post by mortsahlfan on Mar 2, 2021 9:48:08 GMT -5
So the movie I was going to see was recorded because I have automatic recordings for certain directors/actors/etc, and in this case, it was Shirley Clarke (I kinda liked the innovation of "The Connection", although it's nothing great), and when I clicked on it, I looked at the cast, and who was there?
JIM MORRISON
I couldn't believe it. And it's not directed by Shirley Clarke, it's directed by Agnes Varda (I only liked one of her movies, "Vagabond"), and think I saw Jim in the audience of some play.
I guess Jim makes a cameo, but this movie is REALLY shitty so far. I even smoked a joint hoping it would make this agony easier. We'll see.
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Post by leonora on Mar 2, 2021 19:09:14 GMT -5
Thank yo for sharing your favorite lists and thoughts. You are a great music fan. Music is your fantastic friend. I am hoping that you are well, and your eyes are well, too.
I am happy that you found interesting Opsasnick's books. He made a great job, it's a very good model for the biographers.
My favourite music - this is an interesting thing, I am a strange person. So, I grew up in classical music and, in general, the classical music, opera can touch me. I listened every bands, singers that my friend recommended me - Rolling Stones, Pink Floyd etc. - but I did not felt that familiarity what classical music, opera give me. And, one day one of my best friends gave me Jim's poetry, and it made a great impact on me, I was impressed. And my friend told me that this guy was a singer and songwriter, too. She gave me Doors' album, I listened to them, and the experience was a great revelation for me. It opened new doors, to a very impressive, fascinating and deep artistic word, to a new, complex art that includes music, poetry, theater (tragedy), a bit of opera (the final coda of When the Music's Over reminds me it). So, I was shocked, and The Doors became my only favourite band.
Jim's cameo, wow, it is absolutely new for me, thank you! I know that in Paris he one time went with Ronay to theatre to watch a play of Bob Wilson (Deafman Glance). Perhaps, he was filmed in this performance?
You had a lot of wonderful travel experience, but I am sure that after this pandemia you will have newer beautiful experiences. I wish your planes and desires come true! But I understand that in this times you are cautious. (Me too. I also choose to remain at home, to order groceries, books etc., and I leave my flat once or twice a week.)
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Post by mortsahlfan on Mar 3, 2021 9:25:16 GMT -5
Thank yo for sharing your favorite lists and thoughts. You are a great music fan. Music is your fantastic friend. I am hoping that you are well, and your eyes are well, too.
I am happy that you found interesting Opsasnick's books. He made a great job, it's a very good model for the biographers.
My favourite music - this is an interesting thing, I am a strange person. So, I grew up in classical music and, in general, the classical music, opera can touch me. I listened every bands, singers that my friend recommended me - Rolling Stone, Pink Floyd etc. - but I did not felt that familiarity what classical music, opera give me. And, one day one of my best friends gave me Jim's poetry, and it made a great impact on me, I was impressed. And my friend told me that this guy was a singer and songwriter, too. She gave me Doors' album, I listened to them, and the experience was a great revelation for me. It opened new doors, to a very impressive, fascinating and deep artistic word, to a new, complex art that includes music, poetry, theater (tragedy), a bit of opera (the final coda of When the Music's Over reminds me it). So, I was shocked, and The Doors became my only favourite band.
Jim's cameo, wow, it is absolutely new for me, thank you! I know that in Paris he one time went with Ronay to theatre to watch a play of Bob Wilson (Deafman Glance). Perhaps, he was filmed in this performance?
You had a lot of wonderful travel experience, but I am sure that after this pandemia you will have newer beautiful experiences. I wish your planes and desires come true! But I understand that in this times you are cautious. (Me too. I also choose to remain at home, to order groceries, books etc., and I leave my flat once or twice a week.)
You're welcome. I am a musician. Are you?
I do love classical, but not the happy stuff. Minor-chord, piano, violin, no singing.
I was lucky that the guy next to me in class (when I was 13) made me a handful of Doors cassettes.
Jim was actually sitting next to Ronay in the movie. You only see him for about 2 seconds...
As for traveling, those days are over. I did it already, and its not the same anymore, anymore. I'm a musician and author, and its very hard to survive this way, when you do everything yourself. Another thing about traveling is that it's hard to have cultural exchange (or any conversation) with most people staring at their phones.
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Post by leonora on Mar 3, 2021 17:20:20 GMT -5
No, I am not a musician but I learned to play the piano and singing (opera, classical songs). And music is central to my life. I am happy that also you like classical music.
Yes, we are lucky you got to know Doors.
Thank you for the info on Jim's cameo. I think that they were filmed indeed in performance of Wilson's play.
I understood you, and you are right, this phone addiction among the people is so disappointing. 
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Post by mortsahlfan on Mar 3, 2021 17:34:59 GMT -5
No, I am not a musician but I learned to play the piano and singing (opera, classical songs). And music is central to my life. I am happy that also you like classical music.
Yes, we are lucky you got to know Doors.
Thank you for the info on Jim's cameo. I think that they were filmed indeed in performance of Wilson's play.
I understood you, and you are right, this phone addiction among the people is so disappointing.
I especially love 70s prog rock.. Lots of eclectic elements, classical being a main one... Bands like Curved Air, Illusion, Carol of Harvest, etc etc... Because of the way classical pieces are titled, "E-flat in Nocturne" etc., it's a little difficult to remember the pieces, but the first few that come to mind are Satie's Gymnopedie #2 and Debussy - Claire de Lune, but I've always spent a little bit of time throughout the years looking.
I just finished that book. I enjoyed it very much. Thanks for the recommendation... That's another thing I keep telling myself - keep reading. It allows me to accelerate my (already active) imagination.
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Post by leonora on Mar 4, 2021 17:44:23 GMT -5
E-flat in Nocturne - I love Chopin's works, and Debussy's or Satie's pieces too. And Italian baroque music, Mozart, Rachmaninov, Mahler, Bartók, and Italian operas.
I am glad, that you loved the book. Yes, reading is always a great experience what opens new world for us.
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